Far better atmosphere in clones, great craic about the town on big match days, andytown is a dump, full of joyriding hoods trying to rob people.

wolfe tone (None) - Posts: 121 - 29/10/2008 21:15:23    129308

I've been a regular visitor to Casement Park for all of my life and not once has a hoodie tried to rob me. If Casement was improved (the stadium and the way it is run) I do believe it has the potenial to be a better gound than Clones. To say it is just as easy to get out of Clones than it is Casement is ridiculous. And to answer Baker the Glen Antrim have not played in Clones in a good while, but I can still watch a match there can't I?

Saffron (Antrim) - Posts: 216 - 29/10/2008 23:38:45    129404

wolfe tone hoodies every where to be fair

Dellboypolecat (Tyrone) - Posts: 15069 - 30/10/2008 00:00:27    129428

They did put money into Clones, back in the 1990s and we were able to watch two water polo finals between Derry and Donegal.

The reason Casement is not used is because you had to pay VAT on the gate.

By the way what is a "mobile?" which someone mentioned above.

And a telephone was useful if you were a journalist.

patrique (Antrim) - Posts: 13709 - 30/10/2008 00:00:35    129429

my 10 cents/pence - i'd like it at Casement.. infrastructure has been improved alot, parking is an issue, but where is not? even Croke has that problem! Even into Clones town i've had numerous people saying this as well, we just dont seemed welcome by residents (except the public houses) but maybe thats the "Tyrone" thing ;-)

"patrique" i agree this is a TAX issue why its kept in Clones

the hoodie thing they dont come out during the day, so we should be fine!

oh a question?!?
why was Clones decided to be the home of Ulster football? was it because of Cavan being so successful?

eyewitness (Tyrone) - Posts: 112 - 30/10/2008 09:04:04    129498

Ha,ha,ha,ha, ha. Not safe? Do you want an armed escort? This a disgraceful comment and seems to be condoning the robbery that happened in casement. Wolfettone is correct. And in my opinion the people are the unfriendliest in Ireland, I saw a monaghan fan trying to buy something in a shop with euro (opposite casement) and the response was 'we only accept our currency here' but yet they'd be the first to head to bundoran seeking refuge come july.

Tom1916 (Armagh) - Posts: 2001 - 30/10/2008 09:33:44    129523

Saffron, i find it much easier to get out of clones, there is loads of roads in and out of clones, if i leave clones within a half hour after the match i be sitting in the house within the hour in Armagh. As i have said before, went to the tyrone armagh match in casement a few years back. Crowd of about 22000, accident on m1, everyone going the one way, everyone stuck at lisburn could go nowhere. Got into the match just after half time, if that happened on a road into clones there would be diversions in place within minutes. Other way in to Casement is over the mountain and into andytown. This discussion has been held before and i think it became very obvious that the majority of those who wanted Casement to be used were from Antrim most of the rest of ulster prefer clones.
Forget about infrastructure Clones is also a much better stadium, casement a covered stand for a few thousand people, clones the full length of one side with about another 10-12000 uncovered seats, Clones has entrances into the ground the full way round the pitch, Casement is all of the andytown road.
Maybe the problem for me trying to leave casement is that everyone is trying to get out at the same time straight after the game, get back make sure their car is still there and then get the hell out of there which probably leads to traffic problems as were in clones the crowd leaving is staggered, some people head on home, others hang around for a pint to enjoy the atmosphere safe in the knowledge that their car or bus will still be there when they get back.

samin10 (Armagh) - Posts: 2434 - 30/10/2008 09:37:23    129531

oh a question?!?
why was Clones decided to be the home of Ulster football? was it because of Cavan being so successful?

that was probably it alright

samin10 (Armagh) - Posts: 2434 - 30/10/2008 09:39:24    129533

eyewitness

oh a question?!?
why was Clones decided to be the home of Ulster football? was it because of Cavan being so successful?

Why was Healy Park decided to be the home of Tyrone football? was it because of Derry being so successful?

Clones is central and/or easily accessible to all the GAA counties in ulster, Cavan, Monaghan, Donegal, Derry, Tyrone, Fermanagh, Armagh and Down.

Tom1916 (Armagh) - Posts: 2001 - 30/10/2008 09:40:19    129535

Patrique you're right about Belfast- immense GAA potential and a number of very strong clbs.

I prefer Clones myself though. Better craic, more pubs etc closer to the field and just feels like a day out. Casement lovely field etc but just doesnt do it for me!

Goodfella, Tir (None) - Posts: 1652 - 30/10/2008 10:17:39    129576

As far as I understand it this has been an issue to do with VAT. I used to think there was some significant local influence being exerted (presuming Ulster finals at Clones are a big boon to the area) - but the speed at which finals were moved to Croker showed how much the revenues were central to thinking. I suppose from a lot of people's perspective it was fair enough to want to keep the match in the Republic until the mid-1990s, but that excuse has long since evaporated. I imagine very few people (Patrique aside) can remember Ulster finals at Casement, so most aren't in a position to compare the two as an event. Would it kill the Ulster council to play a football final at Casement to see how it works out?
As to the posters who claimed that Belfast/Antrim isn't a GAA county - only Tyrone and Armagh have as many or more clubs than Antrim (all just over 50). You might think its alrigh to have a go - but its a miracle Antrim has as many clubs. To put it in a historical perspective - there are two grass pitches for GAA in North Belfast - one owned by St Endas GAC in Glengormley (just outside Belfast) and the Crickey, the only council pitch (which has no changing rooms, an awful surface, and can't be used for senior games). None of the secondary schools in North Belfast have enough ground to have a grass pitch. It's a miracle that three clubs (Ardoyne, Pearses and St Endas) have survived in North Belfast. West Belfast has much better provision (and 18-19 clubs) but nothing like any medium sized town in the Republic. The Ulster Council have simply continued this trend by not allowing Ulster finals at Clones.

pearsesabu (Antrim) - Posts: 663 - 30/10/2008 10:19:52    129578

Does Casement not get the Hurling Final.
Also Casement is the coldest and wettest Stadium in Ireland.

Monaghan08 (Monaghan) - Posts: 188 - 30/10/2008 10:35:10    129604

pearsesabu you cannot blame anyone for belfast clubs not having facilities or pitches, there is a simple solution, go fundraise, buy some land/develop existing land, get every able bodied club member to give up their evenings and weekends and build the facilities you require. An example of this is Dorsey Emmetts in south Armagh, they are a newly formed club (the last 10 years) and they bought land, developed a top class field, built changing rooms and a function room eith meeting facilities and car parking etc. They did all this in just a few years and they have a total population of about 500 people.

Tom1916 (Armagh) - Posts: 2001 - 30/10/2008 10:37:24    129609

I dont think it is any agenda against the north, plain and simple clones is a bigger and better stadium.

samin10 (Armagh) - Posts: 2434 - 30/10/2008 10:40:42    129612

Eh, I know - I'm a muppet - that last line should read - The Ulster Council have simply continued this trend by not allowing Ulster finals at CASEMENT.

I should really begin to preview my own posts...

pearsesabu (Antrim) - Posts: 663 - 30/10/2008 10:46:30    129619

22 clubs in Belfast alone! That is incredible. Serious questions must be asked as to how this vast number of clubs in Belfast alone equate to such scant success on the national stage

pplocal (Tyrone) - Posts: 5878 - 30/10/2008 12:08:29    129714

Lads just to clarify on the VAT issue i have seen pop up here.

Admission to a sporting event is free from VAT in ROI. This is the only member state in the EU were this is the case. In the North the gate receipts include 17.5% VAT. The GAA must pay this to the British Inland Revenue.

This could have significant influence on why Ulster Finals are in Clones (Clones does hold a few thousand more aswell though).

Just think for example in Euros, a 35,000 Ulster Final at 30 euros a ticket. If held in Clones it would gross the GAA 900,000 Euro, if held in the North it would gross the GAA after VAT just under 766,000 Euros.

I attend all Tyrone matches. Any time the attendance is announced it is always "rounded down" a few thousand as a result of this issue. They obviously have to account for VAT on the official attendance receipts.

My own view is that i prefer clones. What a town for a big game, can't be beat.

Sideline_View (Tyrone) - Posts: 62 - 30/10/2008 12:44:28    129773

Ive been at every county ground in Ireland bar wicklow(although im sure its a shambles) and its pitch is the best bar thurles and croke park..

keep_the_faith (Meath) - Posts: 400 - 30/10/2008 12:48:21    129782

Tom1916 - that is some size of a chip on your shoulder about Belfast/Antrim (want to tell us about it? - set up a WHY I HATE ANTRIM thread for a laugh - I promise not to post any replies).
If you read that post properly you''l realise that the example I cited was north Belfast not Belfast as a whole - a lot of west Belfast clubs have their own grounds plus a reasonable number of public pitches. Don't get me wrong - Clones has a great atmosphere on match days but lacks the facilities for a big crowd. It only became the sole venue for the Ulster final after the troubles started. From the 1950s it was played at both Casement and Clones. The reason for not using Casement has gone now and the Ulster Council should have a re-think.

pearsesabu (Antrim) - Posts: 663 - 30/10/2008 13:04:46    129810

clones for ulster finals..... only place to go mid july.. av been goin 25 years.... casement doesn compare.... i seen someone called andersonstown an estate.. very busy place for an estate,,,, all them shops and offices and that quiet wee road through that estate never any traffic jams on it,,,,, hands up people who thinks andersonstown is an estate.....????

sons.of.erin (UK) - Posts: 343 - 30/10/2008 13:19:08    129840