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Is It Time To Increase The Value Of A Goal In Hurling?

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Haven't posted for many years, but there's something I've been thinking about for a while.

Last weekend's hurling final featured some of the best goals ever seen in the game. And all the talk in the days afterwards was about them.

Given the crazy high point scoring rate in modern hurling, with white flag raisers popping over from 80 yards every couple of minutes - and what seems to be less breakdown action than before - is there a case to be made for increasing the value of a goal to four, or even five, points?

In the last four All Ireland finals, we've seen a total of 219 points, That compares with 156 (not including replays) from 2011-14, 123 from 2001-04 and 114 from 1991-94, and 112 from 1981-84.

Seems to me there is scope for a tweak - or something more radical. And who wouldn't like to see more goals?

TAFKAN01FAN (Carlow) - Posts: 16 - 27/07/2024 10:44:31    2561896

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Replying To TAFKAN01FAN:  "Haven't posted for many years, but there's something I've been thinking about for a while.

Last weekend's hurling final featured some of the best goals ever seen in the game. And all the talk in the days afterwards was about them.

Given the crazy high point scoring rate in modern hurling, with white flag raisers popping over from 80 yards every couple of minutes - and what seems to be less breakdown action than before - is there a case to be made for increasing the value of a goal to four, or even five, points?

In the last four All Ireland finals, we've seen a total of 219 points, That compares with 156 (not including replays) from 2011-14, 123 from 2001-04 and 114 from 1991-94, and 112 from 1981-84.

Seems to me there is scope for a tweak - or something more radical. And who wouldn't like to see more goals?"
Goalkeepers?
Defenders?
Managers?

Seanfanbocht (Roscommon) - Posts: 1832 - 27/07/2024 10:56:28    2561899

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The Aussie rules scoring is 6:1. Gaelic football is considering 4:2:1. It is a discussion to be had. Rugby increased tries from 4 to 5 many many years ago. Possibly 4:1 is a fair ratio?

legendzxix (Kerry) - Posts: 8173 - 27/07/2024 11:14:22    2561901

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Replying To legendzxix:  "The Aussie rules scoring is 6:1. Gaelic football is considering 4:2:1. It is a discussion to be had. Rugby increased tries from 4 to 5 many many years ago. Possibly 4:1 is a fair ratio?"
It's 6 points for a point or goal in Aussie Rules though and 1 point for a wide. I can't see the sense increasing the points for a goal in a sport where there are loads of ways of scoring a goals and points in comparison to the restrictions of other football sports. Increasing points for a goal would probably make it more defensive, depends on the coach. Wait and see what the new rules trials produce.

GreenandRed (Mayo) - Posts: 7582 - 27/07/2024 14:02:32    2561924

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Nah, leave it alone. Hurling goalkeepers have it tough enough as it is I'd say.

SaffronDon (Antrim) - Posts: 2487 - 27/07/2024 16:52:57    2561963

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Leave it alone, things tend to happen in cycles

Fitzy01 (Limerick) - Posts: 407 - 27/07/2024 17:22:40    2561969

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Limerick seem to be very driven by data, stats and numbers.
A lot of the innovation in tactics driven by Kinnerk - line balls always a pass and rarely a long odds attempt at scoring, focus on getting shots at goal off etc. Limerick have never overly focused on goals. Happy to beat teams with 0-30 or thereabouts. Clearly they think this gives more return. I would say 4 points for a goal might see a shift in focus in a Kinnerk coached team. Which given the excitement a goal generates would be good for the game
Would love to see it trialed in U20s level or say Fitzgibbon, even the League- there could be unintended consequences

Yadse (Limerick) - Posts: 47 - 27/07/2024 17:45:00    2561972

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Limerick seem to be very driven by data, stats and numbers.
A lot of the innovation in tactics driven by Kinnerk - line balls always a pass and rarely a long odds attempt at scoring, focus on getting shots at goal off etc. Limerick have never overly focused on goals. Happy to beat teams with 0-30 or thereabouts. Clearly they think this gives more return. I would say 4 points for a goal might see a shift in focus in a Kinnerk coached team. Which given the excitement a goal generates would be good for the game
Would love to see it trialed in U20s level or say Fitzgibbon, even the League- there could be unintended consequences

Yadse (Limerick) - Posts: 47 - 27/07/2024 17:45:00    2561973

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A very definite NO from me to the question.

PoolSturgeon (Galway) - Posts: 1947 - 27/07/2024 18:02:27    2561977

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No, teams would become more defensive

Onfor15 (Wexford) - Posts: 530 - 27/07/2024 18:10:17    2561978

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leave the greatest game in the world alone

mickcunningham (Westmeath) - Posts: 1860 - 27/07/2024 19:06:14    2561988

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Replying To mickcunningham:  "leave the greatest game in the world alone"
100% agree…. Look at the total mess that has been made of football with all the stupid rule changes.. and now the great Jarlath has commissioned a group to try and come up with more changes… Leave the hurling alone for goodness sake…

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 2811 - 27/07/2024 19:20:50    2561993

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Should scoring a point be made more difficult instead? - say, a two-line pass is required across the defensive 45/65, both 65s or attacking 65/45 before a point attempt is eligible.

Or, just make the sliotar denser like the good old days?

omahant (USA) - Posts: 2833 - 27/07/2024 19:22:09    2561994

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Top priorities should be to spread the game in less developed counties, followed of course, by getting rid of the "thrown pass".

omahant (USA) - Posts: 2833 - 27/07/2024 19:34:09    2561999

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Replying To Fitzy01:  "Leave it alone, things tend to happen in cycles"
This is not a cycle. It's a clear trend.

TAFKAN01FAN (Carlow) - Posts: 16 - 27/07/2024 20:08:35    2562005

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Replying To Yadse:  "Limerick seem to be very driven by data, stats and numbers.
A lot of the innovation in tactics driven by Kinnerk - line balls always a pass and rarely a long odds attempt at scoring, focus on getting shots at goal off etc. Limerick have never overly focused on goals. Happy to beat teams with 0-30 or thereabouts. Clearly they think this gives more return. I would say 4 points for a goal might see a shift in focus in a Kinnerk coached team. Which given the excitement a goal generates would be good for the game
Would love to see it trialed in U20s level or say Fitzgibbon, even the League- there could be unintended consequences"
That's a well reasoned post. Thanks.

TAFKAN01FAN (Carlow) - Posts: 16 - 27/07/2024 20:11:11    2562006

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Replying To omahant:  "Should scoring a point be made more difficult instead? - say, a two-line pass is required across the defensive 45/65, both 65s or attacking 65/45 before a point attempt is eligible.

Or, just make the sliotar denser like the good old days?"
Would agree 100% with sliotars going back to how they were even 20 years ago. Have definitely got lighter because of less density. I remember getting hit with an old sliotar in the chest and it was like a rock hitting you. I would (and have) happily stood in goal with no hurl with the modern ball as you could genuinely let them hit you without a hurl. Hurling is great but would make a minimum sliotar weight more than it is now and in line with the 90s even

MLR (Carlow) - Posts: 76 - 27/07/2024 20:25:22    2562008

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Replying To MLR:  "Would agree 100% with sliotars going back to how they were even 20 years ago. Have definitely got lighter because of less density. I remember getting hit with an old sliotar in the chest and it was like a rock hitting you. I would (and have) happily stood in goal with no hurl with the modern ball as you could genuinely let them hit you without a hurl. Hurling is great but would make a minimum sliotar weight more than it is now and in line with the 90s even"
Apparently, there's a safety issue with the sliothar. The country is more litigious nowadays and the GAA has fears in this regard.

CARPS (Carlow) - Posts: 689 - 28/07/2024 11:07:24    2562095

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Replying To MLR:  "Would agree 100% with sliotars going back to how they were even 20 years ago. Have definitely got lighter because of less density. I remember getting hit with an old sliotar in the chest and it was like a rock hitting you. I would (and have) happily stood in goal with no hurl with the modern ball as you could genuinely let them hit you without a hurl. Hurling is great but would make a minimum sliotar weight more than it is now and in line with the 90s even"
There is definitely a huge difference in the sliotar. In our day. If it got wet it was like lead and would rip your flesh off. Has the change given us the fast game and the precision we love today ? The flow of scores that keeps us on our toes ? The attraction to the young boy and girl knowing he or she can contribute to the score and drive it past their shoes laces ? I have an open mind on it. Maybe be slightly heavier. That might make it easier to direct and less influenced by wind taking it off course. One thing I do prefer our game now from the 1-6 to 1-5 score line games.

Canuck (Waterford) - Posts: 2854 - 28/07/2024 14:06:09    2562134

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Replying To Canuck:  "There is definitely a huge difference in the sliotar. In our day. If it got wet it was like lead and would rip your flesh off. Has the change given us the fast game and the precision we love today ? The flow of scores that keeps us on our toes ? The attraction to the young boy and girl knowing he or she can contribute to the score and drive it past their shoes laces ? I have an open mind on it. Maybe be slightly heavier. That might make it easier to direct and less influenced by wind taking it off course. One thing I do prefer our game now from the 1-6 to 1-5 score line games."
Agree with all of that Canuck.

Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 13407 - 28/07/2024 14:25:30    2562140

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