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Replying To tirawleybaron: "I recently made a suggestion to modify the current Grading system for underage players, as it is detrimental to urban clubs ability to retain players.
Having played for a small club at B level, we had the same players every year and the coaches had many years to develop a team and coach players (coaching methods were questionable back then to success was limited).
However, since I now coach in a large urban club, it strikes me that the grading system implemented by the county board causes a lot of drop off, as if you dont make the A or B team, your basically excluded from the good coaches and left to rot, which translates to larger differences in skills from U14-18, which, bar the odd exception, becomes irrecoverable, disheartening and ultimately leads to giving up the sport.
In Mayo, a clubs A squad must be named with 15 players, similarly for B squads etc. However, if you go up from B to A to play as a sub, you can no longer play B, with the net result of less game time and less development.
Worse still, if you start the season in C - there is no chance of A football and moving up to B again results in less game time and slower development.
The kids named in A or B - who might be playing corner forward or corner back, don't get the chance to develop skills in other positions (particularly in A football, as it is so competitive). Dropping down to B is not really possible unless you stink the place out with how bad you play.
Essentially, the system is designed to prevent player development, as doing so risks a serious reduction in overall game time.
The other issue is that if you best mate(s) are in a lower (or higher) grade, players lose enjoyment and drop off to play another sport where they can play with their mates - this one being the main reason to give up in ladies football.
Add this to nepotism - the traditional GAA families doing the coaching and picking their own kids in A&B and you create a them and us mentality, which again, creates division and more kids giving up the sport.
I am curious to know if anyone has experience of any urban GAA club who is successfully managing to keep kids (and particularly late developers from a non GAA background) playing for the club through their teenage years (drop off rate <50%).
I recently proposed the following to a county board rep, which would upset a lot of rural clubs, but lets face it - the push to urbanism is not going away and if we want to expand playing numbers we have to target retention of players in urban areas.
Grading system changes (example for U16 level)
A team - designate 66% of team (10 players) as A for the full season
A development squad - designate 15 players who can move between A&B but with maximum of 33% of gametime at B.
A potentials squad - designate 5 players (3xU16 and 2xU15) who can play A&B - maximum of 66%% of game time in lower grade.
B team - designate 10 players (U15's) as B team for the season.
The above system allows a club with 40 players to give most of them a shot at A football during the season without cutting off their ability to play B, while limiting the unscrupulous club from overloading the B team to get short term results.
The above then returns to the standard 15 A team players system for the championship.
The playing time restrictions can be tracked easily on an app.
One team rural clubs would cry foul as they rely on urban club wastage to be competitive at minor, U20 and senior levels. However, for the good of the sport overall, retention of playing numbers in urban areas is key." I'll have to check for you but down here in Wexford if a lad plays for a clubs 1st team he's still allowed play for their second team afterwards at underage afaik.
With lads having to cover for other lads with holidays, injuries etc I'm not sure you can run underage like adult.
Another difference is that with our parish rule you can't just transfer to a rural club because you don't make it at an urban one.
In any case alot of our urban clubs aren't winning top division titles anyway.
The biggest problem we have down here is that our town clubs are relatively weak by and large. And facing huge competition from other sports, soccer primarily.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16953 - 28/08/2025 13:45:06
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Not really an issue here in Wexford in the way that the Baron describes, as no club here is fielding more than one team at U16 or U18 anyway.
For those that field two teams in U12 and/or U14 competition, the way it works is this:
- U12 is 13-a-side. You name ten players who can play for your 'A' team only. Numbers 11, 12, 13, etc. in your 'rankings' can play up and down all year long, with no restrictions.
- U14 is 15-a-side. Works much the same way, except I think you name twelve players. Again, anybody not on that list can move between both sides all year long, with no restrictions.
It allows everyone who's within the 'A' team standard to get at least one run with that team at some stage of the year, without losing out by not being able to drop back down to their usual level. Also means that when some of your top ten or top twelve are unavailable, you don't have to worry about who you bring up from the 'B' team to fill in for them.
In essence, it's not a million miles removed from what the Baron proposes. I'll be nice to him here, and say it's one of his better suggestions. :)
I'd remove the bit about restrictions on playing times though, as that would make it overly complex. For starters, who's going to operate the app? Referee has enough to be doing without tracking the playing time of up to 40 players. And if the club is supposed to do it, well, it's wide open to abuse.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 3045 - 28/08/2025 14:36:40
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But also from the Baron: Add this to nepotism - the traditional GAA families doing the coaching and picking their own kids in A&B and you create a them and us mentality, which again, creates division and more kids giving up the sport.
This one always grinds my gears. The "traditional" GAA families are the backbone of every club. Even if somebody new comes into a club when in their 30s/40s/50s or older, it's a 99% chance that they've already been involved in a different club up to that.
And the children from these families are far more likely to be putting in the practice and the graft at home to develop their skills and become better players, and therefore more deserving of a place on the 'A' team.
I see it all the time in my own club, where I've been involved with groups from Under-8 upwards for a good few years now. It's obvious from early on who practices outside of training sessions, and who doesn't. They're the ones who become the better players...and yes, they tend to come from the "traditional" GAA families in the area.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 3045 - 28/08/2025 14:53:06
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Replying To Pikeman96: "But also from the Baron: Add this to nepotism - the traditional GAA families doing the coaching and picking their own kids in A&B and you create a them and us mentality, which again, creates division and more kids giving up the sport.
This one always grinds my gears. The "traditional" GAA families are the backbone of every club. Even if somebody new comes into a club when in their 30s/40s/50s or older, it's a 99% chance that they've already been involved in a different club up to that.
And the children from these families are far more likely to be putting in the practice and the graft at home to develop their skills and become better players, and therefore more deserving of a place on the 'A' team.
I see it all the time in my own club, where I've been involved with groups from Under-8 upwards for a good few years now. It's obvious from early on who practices outside of training sessions, and who doesn't. They're the ones who become the better players...and yes, they tend to come from the "traditional" GAA families in the area." Do kids practice as much on their own now? Love the game as much as they should?
I think there are far more distractions these days for kids.
We recently resumed training after taking a wee break over the summer. It was pretty obvious there wasn't much practicing done.
I'm talking really basic stuff. Disappointing enough to be honest.
Lockjaw (Donegal) - Posts: 9986 - 28/08/2025 15:29:38
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Replying To Pikeman96: "But also from the Baron: Add this to nepotism - the traditional GAA families doing the coaching and picking their own kids in A&B and you create a them and us mentality, which again, creates division and more kids giving up the sport.
This one always grinds my gears. The "traditional" GAA families are the backbone of every club. Even if somebody new comes into a club when in their 30s/40s/50s or older, it's a 99% chance that they've already been involved in a different club up to that.
And the children from these families are far more likely to be putting in the practice and the graft at home to develop their skills and become better players, and therefore more deserving of a place on the 'A' team.
I see it all the time in my own club, where I've been involved with groups from Under-8 upwards for a good few years now. It's obvious from early on who practices outside of training sessions, and who doesn't. They're the ones who become the better players...and yes, they tend to come from the "traditional" GAA families in the area." Spot on. Ive noticed the same. And I'm not from a traditional GAA family.
Viking66 (Wexford) - Posts: 16953 - 28/08/2025 16:14:49
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I've heard this also in my club,oh so and so is from that Gaa family..people will probably disagree with me on the following point..are all players now up to 17/18 doing to much..I know fellas trying hurling,football,soccer and rugby..I've seen some of them playing and training 7 days a week and look totally drained by Sunday evening..it's also noticeable that a lot of the better Gaa players are also mainstays of the other teams they represent..I've seen a few of them pick up niggly injuries and due to doing to much they never recover properly..I don't know is it down to player or parents pushing them..
I also see with my younger relations that if training is organised they'll go but they do little or nothing at home with a ball,most of the time spent on devices inside..
These are things I've noticed myself..
CTGAA10 (Limerick) - Posts: 2590 - 28/08/2025 17:17:09
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Replying To Lockjaw: " Replying To Pikeman96: "But also from the Baron: Add this to nepotism - the traditional GAA families doing the coaching and picking their own kids in A&B and you create a them and us mentality, which again, creates division and more kids giving up the sport.
This one always grinds my gears. The "traditional" GAA families are the backbone of every club. Even if somebody new comes into a club when in their 30s/40s/50s or older, it's a 99% chance that they've already been involved in a different club up to that.
And the children from these families are far more likely to be putting in the practice and the graft at home to develop their skills and become better players, and therefore more deserving of a place on the 'A' team.
I see it all the time in my own club, where I've been involved with groups from Under-8 upwards for a good few years now. It's obvious from early on who practices outside of training sessions, and who doesn't. They're the ones who become the better players...and yes, they tend to come from the "traditional" GAA families in the area." Do kids practice as much on their own now? Love the game as much as they should? I think there are far more distractions these days for kids. We recently resumed training after taking a wee break over the summer. It was pretty obvious there wasn't much practicing done. I'm talking really basic stuff. Disappointing enough to be honest."
Our lad plays Under-12 and was out with the hurl by himself for maybe 30 to 45 minutes a day almost every day during Summer holidays. Then in the evenings, I'd either spend another half hour or more with him myself, or else we'd be in the field for training or a match or for him to just have a puckaround with his friends there.
To be honest, it's still not as much as I'd like because he also spent hours each day playing EA FC on his Nintendo Switch, but that's young lads for you!
Many of his friends would be the same in terms of the amount they do. Again, they're mainly from "traditional" families in the area.
Two other friends though are not from "GAA families", and I know most of their outside time at home is spent playing soccer rather than hurling. Nothing wrong with that if it's what they prefer, but it's becoming more obvious by the month that they're dropping off the standard required if they're to get starting places on teams as they grow older. One of them is already struggling to make the U12 'A' team this year, and is instead playing for our second team with what are mainly Under-11s.
So, what'll happen is that in time, they'll complain "oh yeah, our lads are being let drop by the wayside, but the Murphys/Doyles/Byrnes (not our real names) are still being picked all the time, because they're "GAA families"". But again, it all goes back to who's putting in the effort in the first place.
Pikeman96 (Wexford) - Posts: 3045 - 28/08/2025 22:02:10
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