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Why are people so shocked about yesterday's performance? Anyone following Meath football would know that was coming. A bluster merchant on the sideline.How many chances do the likes of McMahon and the Wallace's want? As for The number 6 yesterday was embarrassing. The two best club forwards in Meath nowhere near the squad. 6 years in the job and not even a kick out strategy.
Edgeofthesquareman (Meath) - Posts: 8 - 31/01/2022 14:02:14
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Replying To latouche25: "Personally I feel If Cathat O'Bric was to come in tomorrow we would improve out of sight. He is tactically very good Brings a positive vibe to the dressing room and training field. He is a very good communicator and has a winning record. Sometimes a new voice is all that's needed to change things. Just look at the Tones A new manager the same personnel and everything changes." You could be right Latouche but he has a more important role to do ATM. I'd 100% leave him where he is.
Blackspot09 (Meath) - Posts: 1012 - 31/01/2022 14:06:21
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Replying To BigJoe14: "Who would you have selected as alternatives in Midfield yesterday? We are currently without three midfielders in Bryan Menton, Ronan Jones and Jack Flynn due to injury and Brian Conlon is only back from a shoulder injury. I agree that the two lads are not playing in their best position, but what are the alternatives? Give us some names, as you clearly know better than the management that are looking at every possible player that could play midfield in the county. Not two other players in the current squad that are available could have played midfield yesterday, other than the two lads who played yesterday. And I hate to break it to you, but the best players in the Meath club football, at the moment, are in the squad. So their isn't some superstars out there that haven't been asked in or given a chance. Anyone that is good enough to play is in their at the moment or has at least been asked in and have turned it down. A list of current club players not currently in the squad but would be good enough to be on the squad:
James Toher: Committed to hurlers. Nothing personal against management, as some would like to believe
Aaron Lynch: Will have to be called in, but don't expect anything different that what is already there.
Donal Lenihan: Left last year due to lack of game time. Would be good enough to play.
David McGowan: Has been in before, would be good enough to play again
That's about it folks. Don't mention last years Meath minors because they have not even played adult football with their clubs yet. Our best hope for finding new players at the moment is from the U20 panel. They need to do well this year, otherwise we will make no progress at senior level. Kildare won an All Ireland U20 in 2019, and have been extremely competitive at this level since 2008 when they reached an all Ireland final. Galway won an All Ireland U20 in 2020, Roscommon and were in an Ireland U20 final last year and Offaly won it, Monaghan Ulster finals, Cavan winning Ulster U'21s, Mayo won the All Ireland U21 in 2016, all teams we need to be competing with on our level, in order to get up to Dublin, Tyrone and Kerry." Good post Bigjoe 14. You are one of the few posters on this forum that talks sense. You are also one of the few posters that seems to know Meath football and the lack of options out there to improve this Meath team. It galls me that so many posters criticise the current players without coming up with alternatives.
kingofclubs (Meath) - Posts: 330 - 31/01/2022 14:21:26
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Replying To BigJoe14: "Who would you have selected as alternatives in Midfield yesterday? We are currently without three midfielders in Bryan Menton, Ronan Jones and Jack Flynn due to injury and Brian Conlon is only back from a shoulder injury. I agree that the two lads are not playing in their best position, but what are the alternatives? Give us some names, as you clearly know better than the management that are looking at every possible player that could play midfield in the county. Not two other players in the current squad that are available could have played midfield yesterday, other than the two lads who played yesterday. And I hate to break it to you, but the best players in the Meath club football, at the moment, are in the squad. So their isn't some superstars out there that haven't been asked in or given a chance. Anyone that is good enough to play is in their at the moment or has at least been asked in and have turned it down. A list of current club players not currently in the squad but would be good enough to be on the squad:
James Toher: Committed to hurlers. Nothing personal against management, as some would like to believe
Aaron Lynch: Will have to be called in, but don't expect anything different that what is already there.
Donal Lenihan: Left last year due to lack of game time. Would be good enough to play.
David McGowan: Has been in before, would be good enough to play again
That's about it folks. Don't mention last years Meath minors because they have not even played adult football with their clubs yet. Our best hope for finding new players at the moment is from the U20 panel. They need to do well this year, otherwise we will make no progress at senior level. Kildare won an All Ireland U20 in 2019, and have been extremely competitive at this level since 2008 when they reached an all Ireland final. Galway won an All Ireland U20 in 2020, Roscommon and were in an Ireland U20 final last year and Offaly won it, Monaghan Ulster finals, Cavan winning Ulster U'21s, Mayo won the All Ireland U21 in 2016, all teams we need to be competing with on our level, in order to get up to Dublin, Tyrone and Kerry." Great post. You seem to have knowledge of whats actually going on in the county and i know for a fact a lot of this is accurate. The best players in the county are on the panel.
redser123 (Meath) - Posts: 404 - 31/01/2022 14:31:42
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Replying To summerof09: "Up there with the loss to Westmeath seven years ago? There has been a lot more humiliating and miserable defeats since then under the current regime in case you forgot about these.
2017 league against Kildare, beaten by ten points
2017 Leinster semi final against Kildare, beaten by nine points
2018 league against Tipperary, beaten by eight points
2018 Leinster quarter final, beaten by Longford for the first time since 1982
2019 Leinster final, beaten out the gate by Dublin, we scored one point in the first half (one better than yesterday)
2019 All Ireland quarter final against Mayo, second half collapse when we had them on the rack
2020 Leinster final, rolled over for the Dubs again, scored two points in the first half
2021 Leinster final, decided not to show up for the first half AGAIN
Pat Spillane hit the nail on the head inconsistency within matches and from match to match seems to be our biggest problem.
It's all about confidence as well. The manager's task is instilling confidence into his players. That will get rid of the inconsistent performances but it's not happening for this Meath team." Nothing will ever compare to that loss to a extremely poor Westmeath team. Perhaps if we get beat by Kilkenny that will top it. The games you have mentioned at least the teams were half decent and we weren't defending a 130 year plus record. That for some reason our inept management didn't even know we had. Yesterday was terrible but NOTHING will ever surpass the embarrassment of loosing to Westmeath. Nothing.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 31/01/2022 14:35:41
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Replying To royaldunne: "Nothing will ever compare to that loss to a extremely poor Westmeath team. Perhaps if we get beat by Kilkenny that will top it. The games you have mentioned at least the teams were half decent and we weren't defending a 130 year plus record. That for some reason our inept management didn't even know we had. Yesterday was terrible but NOTHING will ever surpass the embarrassment of loosing to Westmeath. Nothing." This is quite embarrassing and really shows how far our standards have slipped.
summerof09 (Meath) - Posts: 324 - 31/01/2022 15:47:08
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Replying To royaldunne: "Nothing will ever compare to that loss to a extremely poor Westmeath team. Perhaps if we get beat by Kilkenny that will top it. The games you have mentioned at least the teams were half decent and we weren't defending a 130 year plus record. That for some reason our inept management didn't even know we had. Yesterday was terrible but NOTHING will ever surpass the embarrassment of loosing to Westmeath. Nothing." The only reason you care about that loss is the fact you're living in Westmeath.
Most people in the county don't care about it, it's 7 years ago and done with. What we do care about is where we are going with this current team and management.
UsernameInvalid (Meath) - Posts: 409 - 31/01/2022 15:54:58
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Replying To kingofclubs: "Good post Bigjoe 14. You are one of the few posters on this forum that talks sense. You are also one of the few posters that seems to know Meath football and the lack of options out there to improve this Meath team. It galls me that so many posters criticise the current players without coming up with alternatives." Yes the 2 lads are injured, But they are not setting the world on fire when fully fit. We have struggled for years in the middle of the field. Since Brian Meade left nobody replaced him. Conlon has been on and off the panel for a number of years now and never lived up to the expectations of him. Mc Gowan is only 21 so he needs a long period on the team to develop, plays wing forward with Ratoath so not sure why people would list him in the middle. We just don't have the players in the county at the moment to dominate that area so another tactic needs to be devised to overcome the issue.
latouche25 (Meath) - Posts: 540 - 31/01/2022 16:03:44
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Replying To BigJoe14: "Who would you have selected as alternatives in Midfield yesterday? We are currently without three midfielders in Bryan Menton, Ronan Jones and Jack Flynn due to injury and Brian Conlon is only back from a shoulder injury. I agree that the two lads are not playing in their best position, but what are the alternatives? Give us some names, as you clearly know better than the management that are looking at every possible player that could play midfield in the county. Not two other players in the current squad that are available could have played midfield yesterday, other than the two lads who played yesterday. And I hate to break it to you, but the best players in the Meath club football, at the moment, are in the squad. So their isn't some superstars out there that haven't been asked in or given a chance. Anyone that is good enough to play is in their at the moment or has at least been asked in and have turned it down. A list of current club players not currently in the squad but would be good enough to be on the squad:
James Toher: Committed to hurlers. Nothing personal against management, as some would like to believe
Aaron Lynch: Will have to be called in, but don't expect anything different that what is already there.
Donal Lenihan: Left last year due to lack of game time. Would be good enough to play.
David McGowan: Has been in before, would be good enough to play again
That's about it folks. Don't mention last years Meath minors because they have not even played adult football with their clubs yet. Our best hope for finding new players at the moment is from the U20 panel. They need to do well this year, otherwise we will make no progress at senior level. Kildare won an All Ireland U20 in 2019, and have been extremely competitive at this level since 2008 when they reached an all Ireland final. Galway won an All Ireland U20 in 2020, Roscommon and were in an Ireland U20 final last year and Offaly won it, Monaghan Ulster finals, Cavan winning Ulster U'21s, Mayo won the All Ireland U21 in 2016, all teams we need to be competing with on our level, in order to get up to Dublin, Tyrone and Kerry." Yes, Jones and Menton are probably currently our best option, I agree. But Mc Entee is 5 years looking at the this problem. It was up to him to fix it. Mould a player into into a midfielder that can actually catch a ball. what are going do throw your hands in air a wait for John Mc Dermot to rock up ? Or set about solving the problem.
You mentioned Toher alot more have been tried Flanagan Rooney, Shane Mc Entee and others, all did'nt work out. I will say he is unlucky with Nash and Mc Bride in fairness, But Mc Entee failed utterly in this area. He had plenty of time find a solution and failed.
bobkarlgees (Meath) - Posts: 1265 - 31/01/2022 16:05:24
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Replying To bobkarlgees: "Yes, Jones and Menton are probably currently our best option, I agree. But Mc Entee is 5 years looking at the this problem. It was up to him to fix it. Mould a player into into a midfielder that can actually catch a ball. what are going do throw your hands in air a wait for John Mc Dermot to rock up ? Or set about solving the problem.
You mentioned Toher alot more have been tried Flanagan Rooney, Shane Mc Entee and others, all did'nt work out. I will say he is unlucky with Nash and Mc Bride in fairness, But Mc Entee failed utterly in this area. He had plenty of time find a solution and failed." Andy has Menton and Jones and he has moulded menton into a better centre fielder. Unlucky with Mcbride and nash. Sadly it's not as easy as "find a solution" or mould someone into a top class intercounty midfield. Not many counties have 4 options for the middle and we were without all 4.
Not defending Andy as I think he was run his course and time for a change now, it looked stale as it did towards end of micko. But top class intercounty players don't grow on trees. Bar a handful I think we have our best players on the panel.
The issues Andy has stared at for 5 years without improving are kick out strategy and structured attacking football. Those are two areas you can improve but not fair to say he was waiting for the next John McDermott, we don't have one in the county, maybe one in Australia.
Thejoeshow (Meath) - Posts: 687 - 31/01/2022 16:20:22
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Replying To UsernameInvalid: "The only reason you care about that loss is the fact you're living in Westmeath.
Most people in the county don't care about it, it's 7 years ago and done with. What we do care about is where we are going with this current team and management." Nope plenty of people care about it. It was the lowest point we have ever reached.
However where we are going now is very worrying
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 31/01/2022 16:35:01
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Replying To Thejoeshow: "Andy has Menton and Jones and he has moulded menton into a better centre fielder. Unlucky with Mcbride and nash. Sadly it's not as easy as "find a solution" or mould someone into a top class intercounty midfield. Not many counties have 4 options for the middle and we were without all 4.
Not defending Andy as I think he was run his course and time for a change now, it looked stale as it did towards end of micko. But top class intercounty players don't grow on trees. Bar a handful I think we have our best players on the panel.
The issues Andy has stared at for 5 years without improving are kick out strategy and structured attacking football. Those are two areas you can improve but not fair to say he was waiting for the next John McDermott, we don't have one in the county, maybe one in Australia." Sensible post.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 31/01/2022 16:37:36
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Replying To Thejoeshow: "Andy has Menton and Jones and he has moulded menton into a better centre fielder. Unlucky with Mcbride and nash. Sadly it's not as easy as "find a solution" or mould someone into a top class intercounty midfield. Not many counties have 4 options for the middle and we were without all 4.
Not defending Andy as I think he was run his course and time for a change now, it looked stale as it did towards end of micko. But top class intercounty players don't grow on trees. Bar a handful I think we have our best players on the panel.
The issues Andy has stared at for 5 years without improving are kick out strategy and structured attacking football. Those are two areas you can improve but not fair to say he was waiting for the next John McDermott, we don't have one in the county, maybe one in Australia." John Mc Dermott was given time.He was'nt a All star player when he started far from it. He started with Meath around 91 and from 91 94 learnt his trade and developed into machine we seen 95 to 01. Sean Boylan had him move from junior club at the time Curraha to Skryne senior club this helped develop Mc Dermott. (Although Curraha guys might not agree with the move that's another story ).
But its an example of what can be done also to help with player development. No is expecting Mc Entee find another Mc Dermott, But I have to say after 5 years the way we have be wiped in this area its not good enough,
Boylan was mad to get Shane Horgan to play with Meath. That did'nt happen either. So Mc Entee wont be the first or last Manger to lose players to other sports etc.
bobkarlgees (Meath) - Posts: 1265 - 31/01/2022 18:42:47
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Replying To stillaroyal: "Does anyone know what Andy's backroom team is? He has changed it a bit - I just don't know the current setup." He's brought in John McCloskey from Armagh and another fella I think from Derry as coaches and Marky Brennan is doing coaching with keepers and kick outs I hear.
TheGreat8 (Meath) - Posts: 4 - 31/01/2022 18:59:36
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Ok so this was a seriously depressing and disappointing day, mainly because many of the basic errors I spoke of hoping to avoid last week were not avoided, and in fact we repeated many of them in stunning glory. The main issues I see from yesterday;
Cheaply giving away possession/turned over
Inability to find men with simple passes
Weak in the tackle, I can't remember one hit of substance from a Meath player yesterday
Inability to break through a Galway tackle
Hogan is a good goalie and for me our number 1 going forward but players weren't moving quick enough for him or creating space and at times his kick outs were ponderous as a consequence
When chances did present we made some very poor shots, our scoring ratio to chances created has not been good enough in recent years and this problem persists
I know we are missing important players, particularly at midfield, and I know conditions were awful but it was 11 or 12 minutes into the second hand before we scored our first point and we had a gale with us, we lacked ideas, creativity and players don't seem to want to use their own initiative. Sometimes in a game you have to take it on yourself, players should not be depending on the sideline to tell them what to do but in this largely robotic era of play where every manager is trying to be a Mickey Harte or Jim McGuinness, that is what's happening. I hate being critical or voicing displeasure at county players or management because I know how hard they work, the time they put in etc etc but damn it all I never want to see such an inferior performance as yesterday again, it's not as if we were beaten by genuine All Ireland contenders because I do not see Galway in that bracket. Maybe it was a one off bad day, and if it was well then we will park it but we will know next Sunday which is a must win if promotion is to be an achievable aim, time to throw the shackles off here and show some teeth in our performances and if we can't do that in response to the performance yesterday and the criticism that had followed then we are in trouble.
Richieq (Meath) - Posts: 3744 - 31/01/2022 19:53:59
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Replying To TheGreat8: "He's brought in John McCloskey from Armagh and another fella I think from Derry as coaches and Marky Brennan is doing coaching with keepers and kick outs I hear." Cheers never heard of him.not to say hes not any good.looked sunday to be all over the place.hope it chamges for navan.
Borderroyal (Meath) - Posts: 496 - 01/02/2022 07:04:12
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Replying To summerof09: "Up there with the loss to Westmeath seven years ago? There has been a lot more humiliating and miserable defeats since then under the current regime in case you forgot about these.
2017 league against Kildare, beaten by ten points
2017 Leinster semi final against Kildare, beaten by nine points
2018 league against Tipperary, beaten by eight points
2018 Leinster quarter final, beaten by Longford for the first time since 1982
2019 Leinster final, beaten out the gate by Dublin, we scored one point in the first half (one better than yesterday)
2019 All Ireland quarter final against Mayo, second half collapse when we had them on the rack
2020 Leinster final, rolled over for the Dubs again, scored two points in the first half
2021 Leinster final, decided not to show up for the first half AGAIN
Pat Spillane hit the nail on the head inconsistency within matches and from match to match seems to be our biggest problem.
It's all about confidence as well. The manager's task is instilling confidence into his players. That will get rid of the inconsistent performances but it's not happening for this Meath team." Not trying to downplay how bad things looked on Sunday but when we're talking about low points for Meath football it's a bit a over the top to list individual league games on the same bracket as bad championship losses. A bad championship loss is much more humiliating and stings/ stays in the mind much more than any loss in the league (if we get relegated to division 3 obviously that will stick in the mind but I wouldn't put any one off league loss in the same bracket to a bad championship loss).
For me the 2014 loss to Dublin (this was the first time in decades we lost to Dublin like this, it has happened since but that game which really made us realise where we were in the modern game) and the 2015 Westmeath loss (and the manner of the collapse) were the worst low points.
I think these 2 losses were the watershed results for modern Meath football, in terms of how we saw ourselves and others saw us.
I don't think good club players have had the same incentive to make the county team as the county team has been regarded as being lower down in the inter county pecking order since then and supporters look at the team in a different way since then.
bdbuddah (Meath) - Posts: 1402 - 01/02/2022 08:43:31
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There's no getting away from it Sunday's performance was embarrassing. In the first 15-20 mins the fight was there but the skill execution was terrible, so many passes that went to ground rather than to chest which on a bad pitch means we were under pressure and penned in. Then the goal went in and from what I saw the fight completely left. Nothing summed this up more than the first attack after half time. We were down by 12, hadn't scored. Had a huge breeze, the hunger should have been off the chart. And yet Galway won the throw up, held the ball for 3 mins with only 1 tackle I can remember and then they got a score. It was horrendous, and that continued for the half, no hunger, no bite. Standing 4 or 5 yards off. I agree with other posters that said the best in Meath bar a few are on the panel (Lynch, Lenihan). But some of the players on Sunday played so far below what they're capable of it was really infuriating. Their only silver lining is that win this weekend and you're back on track. But I can't feel confident about that
LeitrimRoyal99 (Meath) - Posts: 1527 - 01/02/2022 08:45:14
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Replying To bdbuddah: "Not trying to downplay how bad things looked on Sunday but when we're talking about low points for Meath football it's a bit a over the top to list individual league games on the same bracket as bad championship losses. A bad championship loss is much more humiliating and stings/ stays in the mind much more than any loss in the league (if we get relegated to division 3 obviously that will stick in the mind but I wouldn't put any one off league loss in the same bracket to a bad championship loss).
For me the 2014 loss to Dublin (this was the first time in decades we lost to Dublin like this, it has happened since but that game which really made us realise where we were in the modern game) and the 2015 Westmeath loss (and the manner of the collapse) were the worst low points.
I think these 2 losses were the watershed results for modern Meath football, in terms of how we saw ourselves and others saw us.
I don't think good club players have had the same incentive to make the county team as the county team has been regarded as being lower down in the inter county pecking order since then and supporters look at the team in a different way since then." Exactly.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 01/02/2022 11:03:41
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Replying To LeitrimRoyal99: "There's no getting away from it Sunday's performance was embarrassing. In the first 15-20 mins the fight was there but the skill execution was terrible, so many passes that went to ground rather than to chest which on a bad pitch means we were under pressure and penned in. Then the goal went in and from what I saw the fight completely left. Nothing summed this up more than the first attack after half time. We were down by 12, hadn't scored. Had a huge breeze, the hunger should have been off the chart. And yet Galway won the throw up, held the ball for 3 mins with only 1 tackle I can remember and then they got a score. It was horrendous, and that continued for the half, no hunger, no bite. Standing 4 or 5 yards off. I agree with other posters that said the best in Meath bar a few are on the panel (Lynch, Lenihan). But some of the players on Sunday played so far below what they're capable of it was really infuriating. Their only silver lining is that win this weekend and you're back on track. But I can't feel confident about that" A lad said nearly the exact same to me at match. He actually used lynch and lenihane too. And Cian ward. So we have the best senior players in the county without one who was dropped 8/9 years ago, one who effectively dropped himself off the panel (with no bad feeling between himself and manager) and one who is tied to his club until after all ire club final.
So while I agree Andy has probably ran his course as manager. The next management team will have to deal with the same players. These are the same players who I believe sent a letter endorsing Andy to remain and said they have confidence in them.
I'm not singling out any players here as apart from 3 players on Sunday they were absolutely terrible , O'Sullivan is a fantastic player but time and again he can be so frustrating again on Sunday the same faults running into nothing giving up cheep ball, harnan the same. Our marquee player keoghan for first time in years looked very ordinary and ineffective, Devine did he even touch the ball in first half ? Conlon a fantastic little flyer who couldn't kick a point from the 20 line, joey wallace while eventually getting us off the mark should have had at least two by that stage. Walsh looked like he would rather be anywhere else than on the pitch. Surprisingly someone who actually put in some sort of effort was mcentee he is not near as talented as those I have mentioned but at least he gave something of a effort in the first half. The toss call though was down to him and that backfired spectacularly.
I'm gonna say this clearly if any of the 26 players give a **** about the pride they should have in jersey then by Jesus we need to see some sort passion and commitment on Sunday. I don't mind if someone has a bad game. Jasus everyone has them but at least try , leave everything on the field. No more standing off players, be in their face , attack attack attack.
Hon the royal.
royaldunne (Meath) - Posts: 19449 - 01/02/2022 11:27:51
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