Cavan Forum

Championship 2021

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Replying To wishfulthinkin:  "you could say the same about underage management..."
Once again our underage management have shown their total ineptitude for the task at hand.

aceofspades (Cavan) - Posts: 257 - 29/07/2021 01:06:24    2365343

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Another sobering underage defeat last night.. even Fermangh have started to bypass us at underage. Maybe now people might wake up and smell the coffee.
The standard of player coming through is at a very low level compared to the lads who came off them good under 21 teams in the early part of the last decade. (which backboned our team last November)
I'm seriously worried what our senior team will look like in 5 years. We might need to make ourselves at home in division 4. Something is going seriously wrong somewhere and there is a requirement for a root and branch review.
In the first instance, how about giving the young lads a half decent chance by getting better quality coach's and managers involved. How that minor management team got three year's is a mystery.
Get the right people back involved.. Terry Hyland as manager of the minors would be a decent start .

blueskies (Cavan) - Posts: 197 - 29/07/2021 13:26:37    2365481

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Replying To aceofspades:  "How about something completely radical, starting with the U17s,instead of selecting players depending on whose offspring they may be, the club they are from or the school they play for,why not just pick the best players available?Development squads & trials are only a smokescreen to allow the management select the lads which fulfil the three aforementioned criteria."
Never a truer words spoken

tom84 (Cavan) - Posts: 334 - 29/07/2021 15:26:55    2365523

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I'm normally the 1st to defend managers against some unfair comments on here. However our underage performance in the last number of years is nothing short ot outrageous and their needs to be a complete overhaul and the boot given to the person overseeing it. Its a results game and our results are atrocious. Get Terry Hyland back in there with some of those teams, a man who knows how to win. There must also be others.

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1485 - 29/07/2021 22:02:40    2365634

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Replying To blueskies:  "Another sobering underage defeat last night.. even Fermangh have started to bypass us at underage. Maybe now people might wake up and smell the coffee.
The standard of player coming through is at a very low level compared to the lads who came off them good under 21 teams in the early part of the last decade. (which backboned our team last November)
I'm seriously worried what our senior team will look like in 5 years. We might need to make ourselves at home in division 4. Something is going seriously wrong somewhere and there is a requirement for a root and branch review.
In the first instance, how about giving the young lads a half decent chance by getting better quality coach's and managers involved. How that minor management team got three year's is a mystery.
Get the right people back involved.. Terry Hyland as manager of the minors would be a decent start ."
Terry was involved with this years u 20s squad and we seen what happened there. The problem in Cavan is politics. The best players aren't even on these squads both at u 20 and minor. There was at least 15 players sitting at home who should have been involved in that u 20 squad but were totally ignored. If these management teams are left in place we could be in Div. 4 for some time. In the minor match we seemed to have individuals who want a ball of their own. No teamwork whatsoever so it is really down to management. Those individuals should be coached sufficiently enough at these Development Squads to know its a team game. If they don't play as a team leave them on the bench until they learn. Root and branch review needed. TOP to Bottom.

Allrevvedup (Cavan) - Posts: 37 - 30/07/2021 08:56:21    2365672

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Replying To Allrevvedup:  "Terry was involved with this years u 20s squad and we seen what happened there. The problem in Cavan is politics. The best players aren't even on these squads both at u 20 and minor. There was at least 15 players sitting at home who should have been involved in that u 20 squad but were totally ignored. If these management teams are left in place we could be in Div. 4 for some time. In the minor match we seemed to have individuals who want a ball of their own. No teamwork whatsoever so it is really down to management. Those individuals should be coached sufficiently enough at these Development Squads to know its a team game. If they don't play as a team leave them on the bench until they learn. Root and branch review needed. TOP to Bottom."
Just listened to Gary Farrelly interview on wearecavan. Excuse after excuse after excuse. Lads missing, weather, not big enough, didnt get breaks. One of the most pathetic interviews I have ever heard. He was playing Fermanagh in Breffni park. If thats the calibre of manager in the county at underage god help us.

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1485 - 30/07/2021 10:14:50    2365683

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Replying To fredflint:  "Just listened to Gary Farrelly interview on wearecavan. Excuse after excuse after excuse. Lads missing, weather, not big enough, didnt get breaks. One of the most pathetic interviews I have ever heard. He was playing Fermanagh in Breffni park. If thats the calibre of manager in the county at underage god help us."
Spot on. I haven't heard the post match but I heard the pre match interview on Tuesday. My initial reaction after listening to it was that we were going to lose which subsequently transpired.
There are good managers internally that never get looked at. If Terry got the minor Job he would appoint the best background team available to him and put in some decent structure which has been lacking for a long time.
There are other names too, Jason Reilly done a fabulous job with gaels and has been missing since. Peter Reilly is another man I'd love to see back. Players who played under him rate him very highly.
While a full review is needed, start with the simple things by getting the management appointments right.

blueskies (Cavan) - Posts: 197 - 30/07/2021 11:22:40    2365720

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Just a general point on underage football having seen young relatives go through playing for different club teams in different counties over recent years, I've come to notice one thing in particular. Cavan people are obsessed with small fast players. I don't know whether it's something cultural or traditional but supporters in Cavan want to see pacey players taking on their man. Slower more languid styles are often dismissed from an early age and are often labelled too "lazy". I am not sure why this is the case but it something I have noticed over the years. And for all the talk about the successful under 21 teams being defensive under Terry, the standout thing for me was these teams played intelligent football when they were in possession and played with their heads up rather than the usual head down and run 100 mile an hour attitude

97Cavans (Cavan) - Posts: 378 - 30/07/2021 12:21:35    2365754

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Replying To blueskies:  "Spot on. I haven't heard the post match but I heard the pre match interview on Tuesday. My initial reaction after listening to it was that we were going to lose which subsequently transpired.
There are good managers internally that never get looked at. If Terry got the minor Job he would appoint the best background team available to him and put in some decent structure which has been lacking for a long time.
There are other names too, Jason Reilly done a fabulous job with gaels and has been missing since. Peter Reilly is another man I'd love to see back. Players who played under him rate him very highly.
While a full review is needed, start with the simple things by getting the management appointments right."
Please, none of these personal attacks on people who are prepared to take on management roles in the county especially from people who never did more than drive a few cows home for milking in the evening. The problems with Cavan football are not the fault of one man. Why don't we send a deputation over to Monaghan and study how they manage to be regularly in the first division and regularly do well in ulster senior, under 20 and minor championships. They don't always win but by heavens they always give value for money. You know it doesn;t give me huge pleasure to be condemned to watch an Ulster final tomorrow between Monaghan and Tyrone or an under 20 final between Down and MONAGHAN. Get at it lads!!!
Declankillann,

declankillann (Dublin) - Posts: 83 - 30/07/2021 12:24:00    2365757

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Replying To declankillann:  "Please, none of these personal attacks on people who are prepared to take on management roles in the county especially from people who never did more than drive a few cows home for milking in the evening. The problems with Cavan football are not the fault of one man. Why don't we send a deputation over to Monaghan and study how they manage to be regularly in the first division and regularly do well in ulster senior, under 20 and minor championships. They don't always win but by heavens they always give value for money. You know it doesn;t give me huge pleasure to be condemned to watch an Ulster final tomorrow between Monaghan and Tyrone or an under 20 final between Down and MONAGHAN. Get at it lads!!!
Declankillann,"
Declan,

I respect your opinion but you dont know what I or anyone else has done or not done for Cavan football. All I know is I dont want to hear managers making pathetic excuses about factors that were the same for both teams. "He cringed when he saw the weather" and "Covid" were two excuses for example.
As for going over to Monaghan, are you serious?? They'd tell you nothing and theyd be right too.

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1485 - 30/07/2021 12:36:19    2365765

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Replying To fredflint:  "Declan,

I respect your opinion but you dont know what I or anyone else has done or not done for Cavan football. All I know is I dont want to hear managers making pathetic excuses about factors that were the same for both teams. "He cringed when he saw the weather" and "Covid" were two excuses for example.
As for going over to Monaghan, are you serious?? They'd tell you nothing and theyd be right too."
One win against a poor Fermanagh outfit in 3 years for this minor management. It seems in Cavan your hired again irrespective of results.Things have to change at underage coaching. Both of our minor teams 2020 and 2021 both fell off the wagon when the opposition started making a comeback. One of the previous posters referred to size . Size wasnt the problem in 2020. Probably more physical than any in recent years. CCB should start looking now for new management teams. 3 years is long enough for any management team especially with no success.

Allrevvedup (Cavan) - Posts: 37 - 30/07/2021 15:47:12    2365846

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Replying To fredflint:  "Declan,

I respect your opinion but you dont know what I or anyone else has done or not done for Cavan football. All I know is I dont want to hear managers making pathetic excuses about factors that were the same for both teams. "He cringed when he saw the weather" and "Covid" were two excuses for example.
As for going over to Monaghan, are you serious?? They'd tell you nothing and theyd be right too."
I would suspect that most people who would have managed teams in Cavan over the past years would be slow to apportion blame to current managers on the principal that those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. On the other hand if you have been a successful manager in recent years l do apologise. l would appreciate it if you would tell us about your successes and how they can be repeated.
l don't expect Monaghan to tell us anything but l do think we could learn by observing - no harm in looking.
Declankillann.

declankillann (Dublin) - Posts: 83 - 30/07/2021 15:59:30    2365849

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Replying To declankillann:  "I would suspect that most people who would have managed teams in Cavan over the past years would be slow to apportion blame to current managers on the principal that those who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. On the other hand if you have been a successful manager in recent years l do apologise. l would appreciate it if you would tell us about your successes and how they can be repeated.
l don't expect Monaghan to tell us anything but l do think we could learn by observing - no harm in looking.
Declankillann."
Beening coaching and managing and youth and senior for 20 years Declan. That's all I am saying. There's nothing wrong with criticism and every manager should know that. I sm my own biggest critic when it comes to coaching. Using covid, weather etc as excuses well that's a man that can't take a look at his own house and ask himself what went wrong.

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1485 - 31/07/2021 10:09:41    2366016

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Oh you can't be giving out about anything here regarding the Cavan county teams… They are all doing great and all 3 had wonderful seasons.. Long may it continue ( and it will ) with the current management in place…..!!!!!

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 3057 - 31/07/2021 12:31:24    2366050

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Oh you can't be giving out about anything here regarding the Cavan county teams… They are all doing great and all 3 had wonderful seasons.. Long may it continue ( and it will ) with the current management in place…..!!!!!

ForeverBlue2 (Cavan) - Posts: 3057 - 31/07/2021 13:02:55    2366060

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Replying To fredflint:  "Beening coaching and managing and youth and senior for 20 years Declan. That's all I am saying. There's nothing wrong with criticism and every manager should know that. I sm my own biggest critic when it comes to coaching. Using covid, weather etc as excuses well that's a man that can't take a look at his own house and ask himself what went wrong."
Pointing the finger at one management team for a systemic problem is ridiculous. We've won one ulster minor title since 1974 & consistently point the finger at management teams expecting them to turn water into wine.
Maybe if we had a full review of the schools system in the county which is light years behind the Derrys, Tyrones & Downs who each have 3-4 footballing nurseries as a stepping stone to county underage football. We have one school competing at 'A' Ulster Colleges level with none operating even at 'B' level. Contrast this with our neighbours Monaghan who have 2 schools consistently at 'A' level with OLSS Castleblayney operating between 'A' & 'B' level. Why not better utilise our GPO's (employ more if required) to assist schools in preparing our St Aidans Cootehill, Bailieboro CS, Virginia Colleges, Breifne Colleges, St Pats, St Clares BJD instead of them spending week upon week in national schools? I know this had happened in the past under previous GDM's but there appears to be a serious missing link between coaching & games & our secondary schools. If you look at the demographics of bailieboro, Virginia, BJD & even kings court, they're all expanding so surely with the right investment & coaches in place teams can be developed in these schools?
How do you expect young lads to suddenly turn it on in a Cavan jersey at u17/minor championship level when they haven't routinely competed & beaten their Ulster counterparts at schools level?
We won't even start on our development squads which have been a basket case ever for the past decade. For some unknown reason, we don't feel the need to operate them at u14 & u15 level…..

BlueRoyalty (Cavan) - Posts: 1 - 31/07/2021 13:11:53    2366063

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Replying To BlueRoyalty:  "Pointing the finger at one management team for a systemic problem is ridiculous. We've won one ulster minor title since 1974 & consistently point the finger at management teams expecting them to turn water into wine.
Maybe if we had a full review of the schools system in the county which is light years behind the Derrys, Tyrones & Downs who each have 3-4 footballing nurseries as a stepping stone to county underage football. We have one school competing at 'A' Ulster Colleges level with none operating even at 'B' level. Contrast this with our neighbours Monaghan who have 2 schools consistently at 'A' level with OLSS Castleblayney operating between 'A' & 'B' level. Why not better utilise our GPO's (employ more if required) to assist schools in preparing our St Aidans Cootehill, Bailieboro CS, Virginia Colleges, Breifne Colleges, St Pats, St Clares BJD instead of them spending week upon week in national schools? I know this had happened in the past under previous GDM's but there appears to be a serious missing link between coaching & games & our secondary schools. If you look at the demographics of bailieboro, Virginia, BJD & even kings court, they're all expanding so surely with the right investment & coaches in place teams can be developed in these schools?
How do you expect young lads to suddenly turn it on in a Cavan jersey at u17/minor championship level when they haven't routinely competed & beaten their Ulster counterparts at schools level?
We won't even start on our development squads which have been a basket case ever for the past decade. For some unknown reason, we don't feel the need to operate them at u14 & u15 level….."
I didnt, I pointed the finger at him for those team he is managing. If you cannot read and comprehend what people write you shouldn't comment. In addition whoever is over the development of cavan underage football should also be replaced as they have clearly failed in their role. Dress it up anyway you want but under that person's leadership we've gone to worst I'm the province.

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1485 - 31/07/2021 14:17:46    2366081

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Replying To BlueRoyalty:  "Pointing the finger at one management team for a systemic problem is ridiculous. We've won one ulster minor title since 1974 & consistently point the finger at management teams expecting them to turn water into wine.
Maybe if we had a full review of the schools system in the county which is light years behind the Derrys, Tyrones & Downs who each have 3-4 footballing nurseries as a stepping stone to county underage football. We have one school competing at 'A' Ulster Colleges level with none operating even at 'B' level. Contrast this with our neighbours Monaghan who have 2 schools consistently at 'A' level with OLSS Castleblayney operating between 'A' & 'B' level. Why not better utilise our GPO's (employ more if required) to assist schools in preparing our St Aidans Cootehill, Bailieboro CS, Virginia Colleges, Breifne Colleges, St Pats, St Clares BJD instead of them spending week upon week in national schools? I know this had happened in the past under previous GDM's but there appears to be a serious missing link between coaching & games & our secondary schools. If you look at the demographics of bailieboro, Virginia, BJD & even kings court, they're all expanding so surely with the right investment & coaches in place teams can be developed in these schools?
How do you expect young lads to suddenly turn it on in a Cavan jersey at u17/minor championship level when they haven't routinely competed & beaten their Ulster counterparts at schools level?
We won't even start on our development squads which have been a basket case ever for the past decade. For some unknown reason, we don't feel the need to operate them at u14 & u15 level….."
Very good points Blue. Could we start by giving local County players a few bob expences to go into local second level schools once or twice a week for a few sessions if we dont have enough coaches to go around. As a young fella l remember Bailieboro' had a seriously good senior team so the genes are there they just need 'watering'. Please pardon the expression!!!!
Declankillann.

declankillann (Dublin) - Posts: 83 - 31/07/2021 14:43:02    2366094

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Replying To declankillann:  "Very good points Blue. Could we start by giving local County players a few bob expences to go into local second level schools once or twice a week for a few sessions if we dont have enough coaches to go around. As a young fella l remember Bailieboro' had a seriously good senior team so the genes are there they just need 'watering'. Please pardon the expression!!!!
Declankillann."
You are aware we lost to Fermanagh not Tyrone or Derry?

fredflint (Cavan) - Posts: 1485 - 01/08/2021 12:06:05    2366354

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Replying To BlueRoyalty:  "Pointing the finger at one management team for a systemic problem is ridiculous. We've won one ulster minor title since 1974 & consistently point the finger at management teams expecting them to turn water into wine.
Maybe if we had a full review of the schools system in the county which is light years behind the Derrys, Tyrones & Downs who each have 3-4 footballing nurseries as a stepping stone to county underage football. We have one school competing at 'A' Ulster Colleges level with none operating even at 'B' level. Contrast this with our neighbours Monaghan who have 2 schools consistently at 'A' level with OLSS Castleblayney operating between 'A' & 'B' level. Why not better utilise our GPO's (employ more if required) to assist schools in preparing our St Aidans Cootehill, Bailieboro CS, Virginia Colleges, Breifne Colleges, St Pats, St Clares BJD instead of them spending week upon week in national schools? I know this had happened in the past under previous GDM's but there appears to be a serious missing link between coaching & games & our secondary schools. If you look at the demographics of bailieboro, Virginia, BJD & even kings court, they're all expanding so surely with the right investment & coaches in place teams can be developed in these schools?
How do you expect young lads to suddenly turn it on in a Cavan jersey at u17/minor championship level when they haven't routinely competed & beaten their Ulster counterparts at schools level?
We won't even start on our development squads which have been a basket case ever for the past decade. For some unknown reason, we don't feel the need to operate them at u14 & u15 level….."
Some of the colleges you mention in the County of Cavan have many former senior players many are still playing with their clubs. May I ask why they are not actively involved with promoting and improving the standards. Many went through the system. I know some are involved at some level but may I ask why is nothing coming through from their involvement. BJD St Pats Breifne College Virginia to name just a few one would have thought these young lads would have picked up some useful tips coming forward and maybe start showing it at Club level, maybe then at county level. I have my own views on manual coaches & development squads but yes time to show up or move on. I read a post it was only Fermanagh that Cavan lost to but to be fair Fermanagh are working on their youth and it's showing at both football & hurling also sadly it's not showing here in Cavan.
I see people looking for the minor management to be gone the U20 management also but not the senior WHY is this I ask. If changes are to be made let's sweep clean and do things right selecting the new management at all levels including the hurling. I heard on the radio today the Cavan hurling manager said they had stage fright I wonder why Fermanagh did not have the same considering it's rear for either of them to play at head office.

I will say one thing in Nicholas Walsh's favour every school in the county knew him why is this you ask well because he made it his business to visit all of them well most of them anyway also if you asked the children around his time who is your favorite player the majority would have said Nicholas.

I am not advocating changes but if it needs to happen then do it at all levels and start afresh.

The Quiet Man (Cavan) - Posts: 4601 - 04/08/2021 00:00:32    2367432

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